Will Hitler be saved? If I had money for every time this issue was raised I would be a rich person!
Let's be unambiguous here:
1. Hitler does not deserve to be saved so if he is saved it would have to be by grace alone.
2. Hitler does not deserve to be saved so if he is to be saved then it would have to be through Christ's mediatorial work
3. If Hitler is to be saved it will only be through deep, heart-felt repentance, through Spirit-inspired faith in Christ and through a renewed mind and a transformed life in the Spirit.
4. If Hitler is to be saved it will involve not merely reconciliation with God but also with his victims. And reconciliation will not be about saying, "Oh never mind! It didn't really matter!"
5. If this is to happen it has to happen in and through God. It is not humanly possible.
Will Hitler be saved? I think so. Where sin abounds grace abounds all the more.
What Christians would object to is the idea that God might treat Hitler as if what he did wasn't really that bad. It was that bad! It was unspeakably dreadful! But suppose that 1-5 above were the case. What Christian grounds are there for objecting to God's saving Hitler in those conditions? Isn't divine grace wide enough? Isn't the cross effective enough? Isn't the Spirit powerful enough?
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12 comments:
I guess the only objection could be that he probably didn't have enough time to "a transformed life in the Spirit" if that is indeed a requirement to being saved.
time to live is what I meant to say in that sentence.
Our God is a consuming fire...Hitler, like most of us, will go through the fire and grace will abound.
Couldn't we all, just as well, insert our own name in place of Hitler's in the list of 1-5? We all have our own 'victims' too. While his sins were far, far worse that ours, they are sins none the less and require repentance and deliverance that only God can give.
Alex
Could the change not take place post-mortem? Indeed, post-damnation?
GM
Gregory:
To help with the unambiguity, I recommend being more specific about what Hitler is supposed to be being saved from. (e.g. "Will Hitler be saved from his sin?" "If Hitler is to be saved from his sin it will involve not merely reconciliation with God...")
I agree with Denver, with the proviso that I am not inclined to consider Hitler's sins to be worse than my own ('small' though my sins may be reckoned in other ways). But I expect Denver would agree with that: sins nonetheless, etc.
To add a bit to Gregory's reply to Alex: in principle and in practice the salvation of any responsible agent from sin occurs post-damnation. God condemns my sins quite utterly. He may put off the punishment for a time--or He might not! (The OT and NT both contain admonitions that the punishment could easily begin pre-mortem; the OT maybe moreso than the NT by proportion, as one might expect considering that the doctrine of the soul's continuing existence post-mortem wasn't very developed for a long time.)
As the Anon said, though: our God is a consuming fire, and Hitler will (like all of us, I would aver, following Mark 9:49-50) go through the fire; that we may all have the one Holy Spirit of God (i.e. the everlasting fire) in our souls and so be at peace with one another.
All that being said: so long as Hitler doesn't repent, God must be leading him to repentance. Forgiveness cannot be completed and fulfilled yet.
(It should be noted that critics often misrepresent our position by pretending we ignore element 4. That has happened recently on this board in regard to a particular debator. {s})
JRP
I can understand the visceral reaction to thinking that Hitler might be saved (and maybe "limosine liberals" like me don't have enough of one), but at the end of the day I have to come to the conclusion that if grace is for me it's for anyone. We're supposed to view ourselves as chief among sinners, right? In that case, I better hope universalism is true 'cause I'm last in line.
Rachel makes a similar point I've made before. The way I see it is indirectly we're shown that God's saving paul was an act on par to God saving hitler.
Paul was a murderer putting people to death. Was he not persecuting the body of Christ.
Paul states to timothy he was a murderer and a blasphemer. And as rachel states, he claims to be among the worst. No doubt Paul saw himself in such a way. I believe God demonstrated his love to the world showing that men like adolph hitler are in his hands. He could indeed break them of their arrogance and take something SO VILE into something SO WONDERFUL.
Aug
I continue to be impressed by Talbott's a assertion that God can't love any of us if He doesn't love all of us. If God loves Hitler (and that seems indisputable if you believe the Bible)then He'll save Hitler. And if he saves Hitler, He'll save you and me!! What a liberating truth!!
I continue to be impressed by Talbott's a assertion that God can't love any of us if He doesn't love all of us. If God loves Hitler (and that seems indisputable if you believe the Bible)then He'll save Hitler. And if he saves Hitler, He'll save you and me!! What a liberating truth!!
The truth is we don't know if Hitler is already 'saved' according to the view that one must repent and accept Jesus as their Savior. We don't know if he repented and asked for forgiveness before he died. So to all those caterwauling about the universalist position that Hitler can't be saved - he may already be, by your reckoning.
If Hitler will ultimately be saved, then there is hope for ME.
Shalom - Nancy
Mercy will triumph over judgement.
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